Bruce Roberts was intense. Disappointments at the 1966 and '67 World Championships drove him to push his young recruits to the top of the podium at the 1976 Air Canada Silver Broom in Duluth, Minnesota. The episode opens on a group discussion which took place in 2022, featuring Bruce, his younger brother Joe and their front-end, Gary Kleffman and Jerry Scott. Following the talk, Joe Roberts joins (1:04:45) to relive the 1984 World Championship where Bruce skipped and Joe threw fourth stones. He explains Bruce's ferocity for winning and how losing wasn't an option in their family. Joe also reveals why he was laughing before a final draw against Mike Riley and Team Canada. Bruce Roberts passed away on December 30, 2022.
Saturday, April 4, 2026
Sunday, February 8, 2026
Episode 100 - Kerry Burtnyk
Kerry Burtnyk was a gambler. He pioneered an aggressive style of play that puzzled and panicked his opponents. Inspired by the Kenny Rogers song, the young team from Winnipeg attempted a freeze on their first stone of the 1981 Brier. A week later Burtnyk, barely 22 years old, became the youngest skip to win the Canadian Men's Championship. Kerry and third Mark Olson, second Jim Spencer and lead Ron Kammerlock, with a combined age of 88 years, remain the youngest team to win the Brier. In 1995, Burtnyk returned to Halifax and outlasted Werenich, Folk, Martin, Hackner and Heidt to win his second Brier. Kerry, along with third Jeff Ryan, second Rob Meakin and lead Keith Fenton, went undefeated at the World Championship in Brandon, Manitoba. Kerry shares stories from the early days at the Assiniboine Memorial through the bonspiels, the Briers, the boycott, and reflects on his incredible year of curling and cancer in 2001.
Wednesday, January 28, 2026
Special Episode - Colleen Jones
This episode is a rerelease of the Around The House Podcast from January 28, 2015. Colleen Jones joined hosts Kevin Palmer and Gerry Guerts to discuss many topics, including curling in Halifax, the 2014 Olympics, relegation, Brad Gushue's struggles at the Brier, and preview the 2015 Scotties. Colleen Jones passed away November 25, 2025.
Wednesday, December 31, 2025
Episode 99 - John Kawaja
John Kawaja was obsessed. His competitive drive led to a Brier Championship as second for Ed Werenich in 1983 when John was just 21 years old. Joined by third Paul Savage and lead Neil Harrison, the "Dream Team" went on to win the men's World Championship, then known as the Air Canada Silver Broom. In 1990, now third for Werenich and with the front end of Ian Tetley and Pat Perroud, John won a second Brier and World Championship. Following a semifinal loss in the 1997 Canada Olympic Trials, at an age (36) when many curlers reach their peak, he walked away. John shares stories from the bonspiel circuit, the Briers, the Battles of the Sexes and battles with European teams, while helping uncover the genius of Ed Werenich.
Monday, June 30, 2025
Episode 98 - Bob Nichols
Bob Nichols was on a mission. His goals were to become an accountant and a curling world champion. Bob captured his first Air Canada Silver Broom in 1974, playing third for Bud Somerville. It was the inagural season for the team from Wisconsin, which included Bill Strum and Tom Locken at front end. His second world championship came in 1978 as a skip, with Bill and Tom moving up positions and Bob Cristman joining at lead. Bob shares memories of Bud, the Superior Curling Club, and many stories from a golden era for USA curling.
Monday, June 23, 2025
Episode 97 - Beau Welling
Beau Welling followed a peculiar path. From studying physics to designing golf courses and eventually becoming the President of World Curling. Beau shares his origin story and how the cancellation of a European business trip led him on a quest to explore curling in Bemidji, Minnesota. Beau offers perspectives on how technology is impacting golf and curling and examines the challenges of self-officiating, suggesting potential approaches for curling to improve while maintaining honour and integrity, the bedrock of both sports' Scottish roots.
Thursday, May 29, 2025
Episode 96 - Ken Horton, Part 2
In Part 2 of my conversation with Ken Horton we begin after the 1977 men's world championship, progressing to the 1983 worlds and the controversy surrounding Swedish corn brooms. Ken shares an assortment of stories including a Paul Gowsell tale, tin foil at the 1989 worlds and a trouser mishap that forced umpire Chuck Hay to rule on the use of denim at a world championship. We wrap with an explanation of the Scottish Curling Trust and its efforts to promote participation and preserve the history of curling.
Saturday, April 5, 2025
Episode 95 - Ken Horton, Part 1
Ken Horton was obsessed about curling. He honed his skills at the Crossmyloof Ice Rink in Glasgow, eventually teaming with skip Robert Kelly and the front end of Willie Jamieson and Keith Douglas to win the Scottish Junior Mens title in 1976. They were the home team at the Uniroyal Junior Men's Championship in Aviemore, losing in the semifinal to the eventual winner, Canada's Paul Goswell. The following season, Robert aged out and the three schoolmates moved up a position, adding Richard Harding at lead. They fell short at the juniors but shocked everyone by winning the men's championship and representing Scotland at the World Championship in Karlstad, Sweden. In Part 1, Ken shares stories from his early days to the 1977 Silver Broom and depicts what Scottish curling was like in the 1960s and '70s.
Sunday, March 23, 2025
Episode 94 - Andrea Schoepp
Andrea Schoepp could focus on the game and nothing else. Her skills developed from curling outdoors with her family in Garmisch-Partenkirchen. At the age of fifteen, Andrea skipped her team, including her mother Elinore at third and Monika Wagner at lead, to a bronze medal at the European Championship. Her and Monika would go on to reach the world championship final four times, winning in 1988 and 2010. Andrea explains her ambiguous feelings on the Olympics, despite winning a gold medal when curling was a demonstration sport at the 1992 Winter Games in France. Andrea shares stories from her many world championships and Olympic appearances, including a bicycle mishap near the Korean border and warming up to curl on the ski slopes. She recalls the challenges of building a team in Germany and the disappointment of failing to qualify for the world championship when it was held in her hometown in 1992.
Wednesday, March 5, 2025
Episode 93 - Toby McDonald
Toby McDonald always chose to wake up with a smile. From his beginnings at the St. John's Curling Club, Toby had a passion for the sport and its evolution in Newfoundland and Labrador. His crowning acheivement was winning the Brier in 1976 with skip Jack MacDuff and the front end of Doug Hudson and Ken Templeton. Their victory was the first for Newfoundland, which joined Canada in 1949 and the Brier in 1951. It would be another 41 years before Brad Gushue captured another title for the province. Toby shares memories from his early days to coaching at the 2022 Brier and everything in between. He revisits the 2006 Olympic games and explains how Russ Howard joined Brad, Mark Nicols, Jamie Korab and Mike Adam to win a gold medal. Toby passed away on January 24, 2025.
Saturday, February 8, 2025
Special Episode - Don Finkbeiner
Don Finkbeiner speaks at the banquet celebrating the 100th Anniversary of the Manitoba Men's Provincial Curling Championship. Resby Coutts provides the introduction and later shares a story of Mark Olson's grandfather in-law's dog to close out the evening.
Tuesday, January 28, 2025
Episode 92 - Bryan Wood
Bryan Wood led the seventies. Woody learned to curl on a two sheet natural ice club in the small community of Justice, Manitoba. His legacy began when he was recruited by Don Duguid at a urinal in the Granite Curling Club. He went on to become the first player to win five purple hearts in Manitoba, winning the Brier and Worlds with Duguid in 1970, '71 and his final Brier with Barry Fry in 1979. Bryan shares stories from his legendary curling exploits, including getting lost after the first Brier victory celebration.
Monday, February 26, 2024
Managing the Ninth End: Canadian Open Women's Final
Avid watchers of prestige television know the penultimate episode is often the most exciting to watch.
A finale provides the denouement; wrapping up loose ends and closing out the story arc of the season or series. It’s the episode before the finale which provides the cliffhanger or plot twist, usually filled with the most suspense and action that can fit into 60 minutes.
The second to last end of a close curling game often provides greater tension and drama than the final frame. One down with last rock (“hammer”) in the last end is a straightforward path—do everything you can to score two points. No shot for two on your last throw? Try to take one and hope to steal in the extra end.
In the same situation just one end earlier, tactical choices can be complicated and taking the wrong turn could flip a team from heavy favourite to long-shot underdog.
Rachel Homan’s team was in this unenviable position against Silvana Tirinzoni’s Swiss side during the championship final of the Canadian Open. Down 3-2 in the seventh end, Team Homan talked through their choices on skip’s first stone.
They could hit the Tirinzoni stone mostly buried in the back eight-foot rings and roll away from the centre line. They could freeze to the stone, but it would be below the button and Tirinzoni could draw in and sit shot rock, making it probable they would be forced to a single point.
Ultimately, they decide to draw top four foot, attempting to score a deuce.
WAIT! Coach Don Bartlett calls a timeout and declares he wants hammer in the final end.
The squad went with his suggestion and switched their decision to a hack-weight hit. They removed the Tirinzoni stone but rolled out of the rings, leaving Swiss fourth thrower Alina Pätz the same shot they had originally planned.
Her outturn draw buried perfectly, sitting on the button. Rachel chose the runback in an attempt to blank the end, and missed.
Homan is now two down with hammer heading to the eighth and final end.
Where to begin?
If Rachel hits and rolls to the open, it’s not certain Tirinzoni will choose to hit. The Homan squad know this and discuss the likelihood their opponent will instead draw around the centre guard. Sportsnet analysts Mike Harris and Joan McCusker mention it as well, referring to a similar situation in the fourth end of the men’s final.
One of my earliest Curl With Math blogposts examined this common scenario of being one up without hammer in the next to last end.
Essentially, the math indicates it is preferable for the non-hammer team to be aggressive, attempting a force or steal at the risk of giving up a deuce.
When watching this situation in recent years, extreme curl and lively rocks have usually forced the non-hammer team to hit the open stone rather than risk the draw. Most often the team with hammer can easily remove a perfectly buried stone and collect their deuce. The centre guard must be in a perfect position, and preferably a friendly colour. In the case for Tirinzoni (and Bruce Mouat in the men’s final) the centre line guard was ideal and the ice conditions, swingy but not excessive, allowed for a well-thrown draw to make things difficult for an opponent.
What should Team Homan do in this situation?
Beginning the end, scoring three or more is the preferred result, but that’s not a consideration now with three rocks remaining. Common thinking for the team one down in the penultimate end is “please just let me have an easy blank and let’s move on to the last end.” It’s not that teams want a blank, it’s simply the chance of being forced to a single point is too great and the reward for scoring two, and unlikelihood of three, is not substantial enough to encourage an aggressive strategy. Their opponent knows this, which is why they will counter with centre guards and attempt to force play to the middle, even at the risk of giving up two points.
Before Rachel’s first throw, statistics indicate the best result is to take two points and lead 4-3 heading to the eighth end without hammer. Consider some historic results …
For all women’s world ranking events from the last two years, five years and over a decade, win probability down one with hammer is about 39%. Looking at results over the past five years from games only between teams ranked in the top 25, it drops to 35%.
Looking at games between the top 10, it’s 36.6% … and between top five, 32%.
Now consider the five-year results of both skips. Homan has won 75% of the time when up one without and 59% when down one with hammer. Silvana is 68% and 56%, respectively. Both teams are—not surprisingly—really good and win more than they lose in either situation. The real puzzle to solve centres around what happens when these two specific teams play each other.
Digging into recent data between them, we find a very small sample size:
• 2022 Players’ Championship, with hammer and down one point, Homan scores a deuce to win 7-6
• 2021 Players’ Championship, Homan is one up without hammer and wins 5-3.
• 2018 Olympics, Homan is up one without hammer and wins 10-8 (Team Tirinzoni in PyeongChang did not include Alina Pätz).
The debate over one up or one down will rage on for as long as this sport exists. Many will never agree but to me, with teams of equal calibre, being one up without hammer is better than one down. However, the scenario does not provide assurances to either side. It’s essentially an uneven coin flip.
The problem with considering “we want hammer in the last end” is that regardless of the decision on Rachel’s first stone, Alina still has a final shot to influence what happens. The analysis for Homan should emphasize “what do we think Tirinzoni will call and what do we want Pätz to throw?”
If the Canadians believe Tirinzoni will always hit an open Homan stone, they likely should play Coach Bartlett’s call, a hack-weight hit. Most often they will be left with a simple blank, and occasionally Pätz will make a perfect hit and roll and Homan will have a runback or board-weight blank attempt.
If Homan believes—as Mike, Joan and I suspect—that Tirinzoni will draw around the centre guard, her decision is less clear.
A fascinating tactical choice that was not considered: If you know Tirinzoni will draw and you want to blank, the preferred call might be to hit and roll out, which is what actually happened.
Homan likely makes the runback over 80% of the time and in the instances where Pätz is unable to perfectly bury the stone, it’s an easy blank.
If Rachel’s first shot sticks around in the rings and Alina draws behind centre, the option to blank won’t be available.
Despite this, Team Homan does not appear to be pleased with the outcome of skip’s first stone.
Let’s move from the numbers to analyze body language. Watching on television, Team Homan appeared out of sorts and not in a position to execute to their optimum ability. Throughout the process—and particularly following the timeout—the squad seems uncertain of their direction, less assured with what they are trying to accomplish, and the result is two missed shots and a steal of one for Tirinzoni.
Using analytics can identify the correct mathematical decision but there are always other variables, and the choice is not always clear. More important than making the “right” call, effective communication can help a team align on common objectives and perform at their best.
Following Team Hasselborg’s gold medal at PyeongChang 2018, second Agnes Knochenhauer commented on their use of analytics.
“Firstly, it always comes down to how well we perform out there on the ice,” she said. “But what we could see when we started to work with the numbers was that our own performance in combination with the statistics gave us confidence in certain scenarios and patience in others. We’re using the statistics to put the four of us on the same path, so that we all know how to take on each opponent. It gives us strength and courage as a team.”
The appearance of uncertainty and lack of unified confidence in team strategy is what came across my TV screen at home. In hindsight, calling the timeout earlier, something they did consider, may have improved their focus on the task and helped with execution, regardless of which shot was called. To be clear, the analysis from my couch could be completely wrong. It’s entirely possible the Homan squad were comfortable and at ease with the situation as it unfolded.
Back to the math.
We considered the desired outcome; one up without hammer is a small preference over one down with hammer. Next to evaluate are the undesirable outcomes; being forced to a single point or surrender a steal. What are their chances of winning?
When tied without hammer and with one end to go, Homan wins 30% of the time, in line with numbers for all ranked games between the top 25 teams. However, Tirinzoni has an 88% winning percentage when tied with last stone, one of the best of any team on the World Curling Tour.
What about two up without hammer? Tirinzoni has won 92% of the time, well above the tour average of 84%.
The numbers indicate if Rachel cannot blank or take two points, she is choosing between two bad options. Considering these outcomes, I would lean towards being tied without hammer because of the sample size from all teams … but given Team Tirinzoni’s capabilities, it’s not an automatic decision and frankly, both outcomes stink.
Assuming Tirinzoni will ignore an open Homan stone and draw around the centre guard, if Homan is confident in the ice and her weight and can beat Pätz there, I prefer their original call to draw top four foot.
If Rachel is most or fully buried and shot stone, above the tee-line, Tirinzoni will be forced to a decision. She could have Alina attempt a runback attempt, pick out the Homan stone or follow the draw and hope to make Rachel’s final draw for two points as difficult as possible. A runback is unlikely to lead to a steal and more often a deuce or blank appears to be the result.
The risk for Homan is leaving the stone open enough that Pätz plays quiet hit weight and sits two, but in some instances this still might leave a possible double and roll out for the blank.
In the early days of the Curl With Math blog, this is the point where a graph, table and equation might show up to explain my analysis. No need to grab your abacus and you can keep the calculator in the drawer for now; I’ll summarize the results.
Given ice conditions, colour and location of the guard, Tirinzoni should, if Homan hits and sticks, ignore the open stone and draw behind the centre guard if Pätz can make the draw at least half of the time. It’s reasonable to assume that everyone, including Silvana and Rachel, expect her chances are higher. Based on that belief, Homan needs to make the come around draw as little as 40% of the time for it to be the correct call.
Ultimately, Team Homan pulled off the comeback from two down in the eighth end and stole the victory in the extra-end (!) against the four-time and reigning world champions.
Like most television episodes of your average sitcom, despite many hijinks and shenanigans over the first 20 minutes, everything worked out in the end.
First published in The Curling News https://www.thecurlingnews.com/strategy/that-curling-coach-timeout
Tuesday, March 1, 2022
Episode 76 - Don Lewis
Don Lewis was an innovator. Being a curling icemaker in the 1970s was as much art as science. Don learned the craft in Saskatchewan, honed his skills with winter sojourns to Toronto in the early sixties and eventually became head icemaker for 14 Briers and 18 World Championships. He was inducted into the Canadian Curling Hall of Fame in 1989 and later joined the CCA board, becoming President in 2001. Don passed away August 11, 2021. Before talking to Don (29:40) Kevin talks with Warren Hansen about his new book "Sticks 'n' Stones: The Battle for Curling to be an Olympic Sport...". Warren also shares thoughts on Don Lewis and Larry Wood. A guest on Episode 55, Larry passed away on February 15, 2022.
Friday, February 11, 2022
Thursday, November 18, 2021
Gambling
Ken Pomeroy of Kenpom.com and Gerry Geurts of CurlingZone return with host Kevin Palmer. They are joined by 2019 World Junior Champion Matt Hall, now working for gambling site Coolbet.com. Matt explains how to handicap curling and the crew share their picks for the 2021 Canadian Olympic Curling Trials.
Tuesday, June 8, 2021
CSI: Brier Draw 19 D1E9
New York Times bestselling author Shane Ryan (Slaying The Tiger) and writer, standup comedian and 2012 U.S. champion Dean Gemmell join Kevin to examine the 9th end between Kevin Koe and Brendan Bottcher in their pool match-up at the 2021 Brier. Shane also suggests a rule change to make teams earn a blank end. You can read Shane’s article on curling in Golf Digest and catch up with Dean on his website. Link to The Curling News to follow along with video and graphics.
Friday, May 14, 2021
CSI: 2013 Canada Men's Olympic Trials Final D1E9
Olympic silver medalists Mike Harris and Richard Hart rejoin Kevin to watch the 9th end of the 2013 Canadian Curling Trials final between John Morris and Brad Jacobs. Without hammer and trailing by one, Morris must decide where Jim Cotter should attempt to place their final stone. Link to The Curling News to follow along with video and graphics, and watch the entire game on YouTube.
Saturday, April 24, 2021
Episode 75 - Erika Brown
Erika Brown started young. At the age of 15 she qualified for the 1988 Olympic Games and would compete in her first World Junior Championships a month after her appearance in Calgary. Erika shares her experiences growing up in the first family of Madison curling, playing third for Lisa Schoeneberg and Patti Lank, then returning to skip and reaching the Olympics 26 years after her first appearance. She looks back on a storied career of 14 World Championship appearances and 3 Olympic games, including 4 second place finishes, and the close calls that kept her from reaching the ultimate goal, a gold medal. This episode also includes an excerpt from podcast episode "Galleria Gold" from Rocks Across The Pond (84:00).
Wednesday, April 14, 2021
CSI: 2009 World Men's Championship Final TLE
James Pahl and Mark Klinck rewatch Kevin Martin's first stone in the final end of the 2009 Men's World Championship. Canada is tied with hammer against Scotland's David Murdoch and poised to win back-to-back titles. What could go wrong? Link to The Curling News to follow along with video and graphics.
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